| |
 |
|
|
Computer Groups Forum Index » Home Automation Devices » Channel Vision whole house DSL filter
Page 1 of 1
|
| Author |
Message |
| Bill Stock |
 Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 4:06 am |
|
|
|
Guest
|
I bought one of these for the new DSL connection, but I've got a couple of
issues.
1) How does one wire up the RJ31 jack? i.e. what wire goes where?
I've got an ITI Simon alarm that seems to have four power wires and two
phone wires going back to the alarm panel. I gather I just need to wire up
the red/green to the center of the RJ31 connector.
2) There is still static on the phone line, even with the filter installed.
Modem seems to work OK, so I'm not sure if the filter sucks or I have a
connection issue. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
| Robert L Bass |
| Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 8:04 am |
|
|
|
Guest
|
Quote: I bought one of these for the new DSL
connection, but I've got a couple of
issues.
1) How does one wire up the RJ31
jack? i.e. what wire goes where?
The RJ31X requires a different type of
filter. It plugs into the RJ31X jack and
the 620 cable (which previously was
plugged into the RJ31X) is plugged into
it. These specialized filters for use
with an RJ31X jack only filter DSL
from the alarm system. They don't do
anything for the house telephones.
Alternatively, you can install a splitter
type filter at the demarcation point or
anywhere else *ahead* of the phones
and the alarm. This method filters
DSL from all of the existing jacks save
one. That one jack will be unfiltered.
Cheesy ASCII drawing follows:
/--[RJ31X]--[phones]
--[STREET]--|
\--[DSL Modem]
Since you describe your unit as a whole-
house filter I assume this latter is the
type you have.
--
Regards,
Robert L Bass
=============================>
Bass Home Electronics
941-925-8650
4883 Fallcrest Circle
Sarasota · Florida · 34233
http://www.bassburglaralarms.com
=============================> |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
| Robert Green |
| Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 12:03 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
"Bill Stock" <me7@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:570mc9F2a87dcU1@mid.individual.net...
Quote: I bought one of these for the new DSL connection, but I've got a couple of
issues.
I'll take a stab at it, knowing I'll probably be stabbed *for* trying, but
hopefully a consensus might occur in subsequent follow-ups. (-: Your
situation is similar to mine. I've got a separate phoneline which handles
voice and the alarm panel and another line for DSL and voice as well. With
the recent increase in rates, I am going to try dropping the second POTS
line with the alarm connection and use the DSL line. I've been researching
the issues involved in running an alarm through a DSL connection and have
come across some consistent advice I'll attempt to relate without error!
Quote: 1) How does one wire up the RJ31 jack? i.e. what wire goes where?
An RJ31 jack is typically used a line seizure device. Since it's critical
that the alarm panel is able to dial out immediately when an alarm is
triggered, the RJ31 jack allows the alarm panel to disconnect any phone call
in progress *downstream* from the jack and then grab a dial tone and dial
out. That's why they are almost always the very first device connected to
the phone network after the phone line enters the home.
DSL complicates the issues because some people want to be able to seize the
voice line so the alarm can dial out WITHOUT interrupting their DSL
connection (which could be relaying images from the house cameras that you
might want to see remotely to confirm an alarm condition exists).
Which do you want to do? Is it acceptable to you for the DSL line to go
down when your alarm dials out?
The RJ31 jack is larger than a regular RJ11 phone jack because the phone
lines must be able to enter the jack, go into the panel, through the
"line-seizure" switch, back out through the jack and finally on to the phone
wires that serve the household phones. The reason for extra wire is that
one pair is goes to the alarm panel and the other pair is used for wiring
downstream to the house phones.
Quote: I've got an ITI Simon alarm that seems to have four power wires and two
phone wires going back to the alarm panel. I gather I just need to wire up
the red/green to the center of the RJ31 connector.
It depends. If the unit is already set up to seize the line in a case of an
emergency, all you would do is maintain that wiring. But I am not sure what
you are connecting to where. Let's start by ascertaining exactly what you
are using. Is this it?
P-0411 ADSL Filter and Surge Module
It's got four incoming phone lines and a security system "Bypass/Normal"
switch on the front.
Quote: 2) There is still static on the phone line, even with the filter
installed.
Modem seems to work OK, so I'm not sure if the filter sucks or I have a
connection issue.
Lots of potential problems. Static can be a grounding problem, oxidation on
connections or just loose wiring. Or a lot more complicated.Let's start
with a traceback from the Network Interface at the "Customer Access point
(CAP)."
I'd probably start at the entry point, plug a phone into the network
interface CAP jack to see what I heard and mentally gauge the interference
level. Then I would split that line to a filter (you should have gotten a
few RJ-11 filters with your DSL kit) and the other to the DSL modem. You
should be connected to just that splitter and none of the other phone wiring
in the home at this point. Not even the alarm. To troubleshoot this kind
of problem, you really need to isolate components as much as possible from
each other. The home phone wiring is a little like X-10 in that different
types of devices have different impedances and electrical properties that
can interact badly.
I'd make this test because you should now NOT hear any noise on the phone
connected to the splitter leg that's got the DSL filter plugged into it. If
you do hear noise on the voice side, you may have wiring issues outside of
your control.
What you do from this point depends on your phone layout. I have a very,
very primitive poor man's patch panel made out of a few phone harmonicas. I
then run modular line cords (I got *such* a deal when the local HW went
under) to each of the phones in the house. No phone jacks, just little
modular cables coming from holes in the floor behind furniture tacked down
with insulated staples. I use couplers and splitters to distribute the
signal within rooms if need be.
It was a heck of a lot easier than installing wall boxes or even surface
jacks since we thought we would only stay here a few years more -- that was
a long, long time ago! I just had to make the hole big enough allow the
modular clip to pass. No push down tools, no blocks - although I started
that way.
The biggest advantage of this barbaric system (I can hear the catcalls
already!) is that you can easily unplug one house phone at a time at the CAP
to see which leg is screwy when there's a problem. Sure you can do that
with blocks, but it took me 2 hours to run 8 phone drops and when I move, I
suppose I could reclaim a lot of that gear. I'd glad I didn't spend much
time on running POTS wires - the Uniden 5.8 cordless pretty much enables me
to put a phone wherever there's an outlet for the charger with a single line
running to the base station. Now the only cords that matter go to the PC
for faxmodems and to the alarm and the emergency corded phones.
Anyway, I would see what I heard through the DSL filter right at the first
split from the CAP. Let's get some more info for the traceback:
Do you have one or two or more phone lines?
Are they properly grounded? Lots of times phone grounds get loose or
corroded and that can create a noise problem. At least inspect it visually
if not with a meter just to make sure.
Is your Channelvision DSL filter mounted nearby and grounded as well? There
shouldn't be any current flowing from the ground connection on the DSL
filter to the ground connection for the incoming phone line.
There's an interesting discussion of how grounding issues can generate hum
and noise here:
http://www.dself.dsl.pipex.com/ampins/groundloops/grndloop.htm
Do you want to be able to use any jack in the house for DSL or will there
just be one or two phone jacks you will use for DSL?
A little more detail will help people in determining what to do next but the
most important thing I can think of first is what I suggested. Disconnect
*everything* at the CAP and split that output to the DSL modem (just plug it
in along with its power supply - no PC needed for this test!) and to ONE
corded phone. If you still hear a hum, it's probably something the Telco
boys have to deal with.
Once we get more information about the noise problem we can move onto to how
to wire your jack correctly!
Is yours a self-install kit? That saves the Telco's boatloads of bucks but
it often means that no trained technician ever looks at your entrance phone
wires, which could easily be 20 or 30 years old with a badly corroded
ground!
Tom_W - are you listening? (-:
--
Bobby G. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
| Robert Green |
| Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 4:05 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
"Robert L Bass" <no-sales-spam@bassburglaralarms> wrote in message
Quote: Given the gentleman makes no indication
of a problem before he added DSL, I'd
say those are not the likely cause. He's
probably hearing DSL noise on the line.
Proper filtration will eliminate that.
I took the following statement to indicate that he DID have a problem beyond
proper DSL filtration:
<<2) There is still static on the phone line, even with the filter
installed. >>
As I stated, since it's likely he's got a self-install kit, it's possible a
technician has not inspected the entrance wiring for years. Or even
decades. There's not much harm and an awful lot of good that can come from
simple inspection of the connection. The time to do that, IMHO, is before
connecting every phone wire in the house to the telco's incoming line.
--
Bobby G. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
| Robert L Bass |
| Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 4:05 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
Quote: DSL complicates the issues because
some people want to be able to seize
the voice line so the alarm can dial out
WITHOUT interrupting their DSL
connection (which could be relaying
images from the house cameras that
you might want to see remotely to
confirm an alarm condition exists).
Which do you want to do? Is it
acceptable to you for the DSL line to
go down when your alarm dials out?
Bobby,
That's not necessary. If the gentleman
uses the method I described earlier
his DSL and his alarm will function
simultaneously.
Quote: The RJ31 jack is larger than a regular
RJ11 phone jack because the phone
lines must be able to enter the jack, go
into the panel, through the "line-seizure"
switch, back out through the jack and
finally on to the phone wires that serve
the household phones...
Actually, all of that could be done using
a standard width jack with shorting
bars. The reason the RJ31X jack is
larger is it can accomodate two phone
lines with line siezure. Because, as
you rightly stated, each line needs 2
connectors for incoming line and 2 more
for inside phones, the jack has eight
terminals. The cord likewise, has eight
wires and the plug is the size of a CAT5
plug.
Quote: I've got an ITI Simon alarm that seems
to have four power wires and two
phone wires going back to the alarm
panel. I gather I just need to wire up
the red/green to the center of the RJ31
connector.
Please do not do that. If you only connect
red/green to the alarm you will defeat the
line siezure function. That means all the
thief needs to do is lift a phone or call the
house and leave the phone ringing (old
burglar trick) to block the alarm signal.
Quote: Lots of potential problems. Static can
be a grounding problem, oxidation on
connections or just loose wiring...
Given the gentleman makes no indication
of a problem before he added DSL, I'd
say those are not the likely cause. He's
probably hearing DSL noise on the line.
Proper filtration will eliminate that.
--
Regards,
Robert L Bass
=============================>
Bass Home Electronics
941-925-8650
4883 Fallcrest Circle
Sarasota · Florida · 34233
http://www.bassburglaralarms.com
=============================> |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
| |
|
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT
The time now is Wed Jan 07, 2009 8:12 am
|
|
|